Toys in the Attic

Mediocre banter and various blather



4/5/2006

Continuing to mine an old tradition…

- Filed under: — Posted by: Jay G @ 2:02 pm

Alternate title: Can you plagiarize yourself?


Over at Kevin’s place, there’s a storm brewing between the 2A absolutists and the pro-2A incrementalists. The 2A absolutists want nothing more than VT-style gun laws, and nothing short of that is good enough for them. The incrementalists see our progress as a good thing, with more to come; they point to the passing of the dreaded Asssault Weapons Ban, the “Stand Your Ground”/”Castle Doctrine”/etc. laws in various states, Protection of Lawful Commerce Act, and concealed carry passing in KS & NE.


These are all good points. Here’s the comment I made on the subject:


I try to stay out of these debates as a matter of course.


First off, I can see both sides of the issue. “Shall not be infringed” is pretty f’n clear, yet we’ve been dealing with all sorts of infringements over the past, oh, hundred plus years or so.


Secondly, how do you eat an elephant? One bite at a time. You posted that excellent graphic showing the change in laws, and it’s crystal clear that we’re making fantastic progress. The absolutists cannot or will not see that we’re moving in the right direction. We’re not teleporting there instantly, we’re slowly plodding along. Tortoise and hare, that sort of thing.


Thirdly, as a “big picture” person (and a chess player), I see us gunnies as actually LOSING, and losing badly. While we celebrate NE and KS and brag about how RI and DE will most likely switch from “may issue” to “shall issue”, the nanny-statists are quietly hiking up the minimum age for hunters, air-brushing guns out of cartoons, and ear-brushing (my term) all references to guns out of popular culture (witness the horrible editing of “Born to be Wild” in the recent “Herbie” release).


Add to that “zero tolerance” policies; overzealous pediatricians asking about guns in the house; “safe storage” laws; etc. and it all adds up to a generation of children completely ignorant of firearms. I’m afraid to show my son my guns, because if he goes into school the next day and tells his friends, he gets a suspension, I get a visit from the cops, and a shiny new file gets created with Youth Services.


So, we win the battle yet lose the war. While we slap ourselves on the back in an orgy of celebration over new CCW laws, the anti-gunnies bide their time, knowing that in a generation or two they can take it all back and then some. When our numbers have dwindled to that of, oh, say, smokers, we’re going to get crushed. Hard.


(Damn, us “big picture” chess players are quite the downer, eh?)


It’s hard for me to get all worked up over this debate, frankly. Sure, I believe, as do the 2A absolutists, that “Shall not be infringed” is what we should be striving for. VT-style CCW laws should be the NORM, not the statistical outlier. If someone is clear to own guns, they should be clear to legally carry guns. Unless and until they show themselves to be unworthy of exercising their Second Amendment rights, they should be allowed free and unfettered access to arms, both in ownership and in carriage.


HOWEVER… I am pragmatic. It took us a long time (~ 150 years) to get where we are now. From the Jim Crow laws that first sought to strip arms from specific (read: black) members of society, to the Federal Firearms Act of 1934 (Rather than admit that Prohibition was an abysmal failure, let’s ban machine guns) to present day, we have allowed our government to infringe on our second amendment rights very nearly to the point of them being moot.


And now we are starting to reclaim that territory. Bully for us. As shortly as 10 years ago, more than 1/3 of the US (17 states) had NO provision for concealed carry whatsoever (interesting side note: When I first got my MA gun permit, TX did not have concealed carry). Almost half (24) were “May Issue”, meaning that you have to have a compelling reason for wanting a permit to carry concealed weapons. Some areas are de facto “Shall Issue”, some are de facto “NO issue”. Only eight states were “Shall Issue”, meaning that if you met all requirements and had no record, you were granted a permit. Only one state (VT) had no requirements. Today, only two states forbid concealed carry entirely (WI & IL); there are only nine “May Issue” states (CA, HI, IA, MA, MD, NJ, NY, DE, & RI); 37 states are “Shall Issue”, and AK joined VT in requiring no permit whatsoever. (Stats pulled from this post at Kim’s).


This is good. This can only be good. In every single state that changed from “No Issue” to “Shall Issue”, every single prediction made by the anti-gun lobby was proven false: No blood ran in the streets. People were not shot for the slightest provocation. Traffic accidents did not lead to extended gun battles. Crime decreased rather than increased.


But… I still stand by my dire prognosis that this will all be meaningless in a generation or two. While the laws are changing in our favor, the atmosphere is not. Guns are a forbidden topic. Gun owners chased underground. Hunting ages subtly raised “for the children” to stealthily keep kids from developing a healthy attitude towards firearms. Hollywood is doing its part (just off the top of my head, the revised “ET” with walkie-talkies instead of guns or the aformentioned scrubbing of “Born to be Wild” come to mind) to insure that children grow up completely ignorant of firearms. School mascots, for crying out loud, are either disarmed or changed completely.


As less and less people take an interest in the shooting sports, there will be fewer and fewer to continue the fight. I cannot imagine that this is sheer coincidence – that we’re making major inroads with only token resistance from the anti-gunnies. Not without paying a price – the culture war. Which we are losing, quite handily, without even firing a shot.


And that price is our future.


I don’t think anyone that lived through the sixties through now can deny that we’ve seen a major erosion in second amendment freedom. Tam at View From The Porch posted a major bitch-slap to some moron claiming that guns are NOW easier to get than ever before:


In 1933, you could send money to Sears and buy a machine gun through the mail, with no questions asked.


In 1967, a fifteen year-old could walk into a hardware store and, showing no ID other than some pictures of Andrew Jackson and filling out no paperwork other than the warranty card, walk out with the handgun of his choice. The only background check might have been the proprietor asking “Is this for you or your dad, Bobby?”


In 1986 a teen could walk into a sporting goods store in a mall and buy a semiautomatic rifle and five hundred rounds of ammunition after filling out one small form and undergoing no background check, and walk her purchase out through the mall, no questions asked.


In 1994 you could drive to Georgia from Tennessee and buy the scariest-looking riot shotgun on the rack with your photo ID and, again, no background check.


In 2006, to buy a simple single-shot .22 rifle, of the type used to teach gun safety and marksmanship to Cub Scouts, here in the gun-friendly state of Tennessee, you must show current photo ID, the address on which must match your current residence address. You must fill out a page and a half of a big tri-fold form, and then wait for the seller to fill out the rest. You must wait while an invasive background check is performed on you and the serial numbers of the gun (even if brand new) are checked to make sure it is not stolen. You must give your thumbprints, for Vishnu’s sake.


…and this, this is “more easily available.”


I won’t even get into the changes I have seen in MA during my time as a gun owner here.


So more states allow concealed carry. That’s good. Repeal 15,000 or so extraneous, unenforced, and unConstitutional gun laws and I’ll start to reconsider my dire outlook. Bring back Yosemite Sam, Elmer Fudd, “Pistol Pete”, and all the other mascots who have been disarmed or changed in the interest of political correctness. Let the next San Francisco style gun ban be laughed out of the ballot box rather than voted into law.


Until then, I remain pessimistic as to the future of the second amendment.

6 Responses to “Continuing to mine an old tradition…”

  1. Sailorcurt:

    This debate has been going on in several blogs over the past day or so:

    The War on Guns
    Captain of a Crew of One

    And a new blog set up for the purpose by “Gun Show on the Net”
    Amendment II


  2. TheFaz:

    I think I’ve responded to your pessimism before, but since I’m bored I’ll do it again.

    1. Regarding the hunting age issue:
    http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi file=/n/a/2006/01/05/national/a012937S11.DTL

    Gives a good overview, I have several other articles that also discuss recent bills (last year or 2) that are lowering the age of hunting. In case you think this is some Western state thing, need I remind you that NY State did so just a couple years ago as well. So the trend in hunting age requirements is the opposite of what you state.

    2. Pediatricians asking about guns – Having numerous nieces and nephews in various parts of the country, my ancedotal evidence is that this almost never occurs. I also don’t see any reporting online or from the various gun groups that this is occuring to any real extent. And again, for a look at the general trend:
    http://home.hamptonroads.com/stories/story.cfm?story=100053&ran=103354

    We see that opposition at the state level is occurring, not approval.

    3. Safe storage laws – After several states passed them in the lates 80’s-mid 90s, I cannot find any report of a state that has passed one since before 1999. So we have the same 17 states with the law we did almost a decade ago, with the majority without one. Again, not a trend moving in the direction you think it is.

    4. Both shotgun and pistol target shooting are some of the fastest growing sports in the country, so overall interest in shooting seems to be holding steady at worst, if not increasing:

    http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,123134,00.html

    5. Youth interest in shooting. What do you base your claim on that children grow up ignorant of firearms? Check out the growth of paintball:
    http://apg.cfw2.com/article.asp?content_id=3175

    No, they are not firearms, but they are analagous to the BB guns we used growing up. Also witness the growth in airsoft over the past few years. Both of these activities show the demand among youth for shooting activities and are a natural recruiting ground to get kids involved in actual shooting.

    Finally, the growing numbers of women gun-owners is undeniable (check out all the recent press), and as they have traditionally been the bulwark of the anti-gun movement, this trend bodes especially well for us long-term.


  3. countertop:

    Incremental absolutism is indeed the only way to go. Firebrand absolutist rile up the base but accomplish nothing in the end. Thats the problem with GOA, et al. They get the base pissed off at the NRA and encourage them to do things that make gun owners often times look as wacky as the ANSWER crowd.

    Sure, the NRA isn’t perfect – but then who is. What the NRA is though is savy and powerful enough to win the fight over the long run – two traits that GOA is not and that the vast majority of 2A absolutists seem to dense to understand.


  4. Cassidy:

    Because I’m still a Democrat, I have to ask: Would you ever compromise the absolutism in the face of no more gun laws ever?

    Scenario: Pro-gun and anti-gun Senator, get together, and come up with a bill. One that will specifically state, this is the last one. In this bill, they will ban some weapons, and repeal other laws that are very inhibitive of the 2nd A.

    Now one, would you support this bill, even if not every tenet. Two, what wold you be willing to let be banned? And three, what would you see repealed? If it isn’t balanced, it won’t pass.


  5. smijer:

    [more absolutist]Why stop at guns? 2A says nothing about guns. It says “arms” Non-proliferation treaties are a violation and must be stopped[/ma]

    Absolutism, whether 1A, 2A, RvW, or whatever – is a difficult position for me to swallow. I’m “for” CCW and unrestrictive gun laws, but I’m also for a degree of common sense, and a respect for a variety of opinions on the matter. Probably more so than with 1A. After all, no one got shot in the face while Dick Cheney was exercising his 1A rights, if you know what I mean.


  6. Jay G:

    Cassidy,

    Given the state of current politicians, there’s no way in good faith I could sign on to ANYTHING they could produce. And I’m lumping Repubs in with Dems here. There is no guarantee whatsoever that ANY agreement worked out today wouldn’t be completely ignored and/or completely overturned on a whim a year or two down the road.

    That said, hypothetically, here’s what I would consider:

    *Moderate regulation of full-auto weaponry and explosives. Demonstrate competency with the weapons and pass a test on the laws governing therein.

    *Vermont style CCW throughout the country – no permit required to exercise one’s Second Amendment rights, just as with the First.

    *Vigorous, strict enforcement of remaining gun laws, such as extra penalties for using a firearm in the commission of a crime, etc.

    Smijer,

    I’m all for allowing relaxed laws on larger arms as well. If you want to own a fully equipped F14 with Phoenix missiles, good on you mate. That’s exactly what we’re supposed to own to keep the government in check.

    And I’ll counter your Cheney jab with another one: Fewer people were hurt when Dick Cheney abused his Second Amendment right than when Al Sharpton abused his First Amendment right after the Tawana Brawley incident…


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